Cannot See the Telltail Water Stream from the Motor
I left the boat in the driveway for one year without starting the
motor. Today, I put the lower unit into a bucket of water, and start
the motor to winterize it. After trying to start it for a couple
times, I finally manage to start it. Unfortunately, I cannot see the
telltail water stream coming out from the motor cooling system. All I
see is some smoke coming from the hole where the water stream is
supposed to come out from. Despite the fact that the motor temperature
was not overheating (only run it for 30 seconds or so), I decided to
turn off the motor just to be in the safe side.My question is: Should I expect to see the telltail water stream coming out from the
motor as soon as I start the motor? Does the motor need to reach a
certain temperature before the water stream coming out? The boatowner
manual said this: "2. If engine is cold, run engine for 1 or 2 minutes ...
3. After engine has warmed up, check water temperature
gauge to ensure that engine temperature is not
abnormally high... Check that water is running from
the tell-tail on the back of the engine..." This seems to suggest that the telltail water stream may not come out
if the engine is not warm enough. Considering the fact that the
overheating warning horn doesn't sound, the cooling system may not
really have a problem. However, the Mercury Operation & Maintenance Manual for my 1995 Mercury
115hp outboard said this differently: "10 Turn ignition key to START ...re-prime until engine
is running smoothly.
11 Check for a steady stream of water flowing out
of the water pump indicator hole.
IMPORTANT: If no water is coming out of the water
pump indicator hole, stop engine..." This surely seems like I should expect to see telltail water stream
coming out as soon as I start the engine. Now, I am really confused with this conflicting info. Obviously, I
don't want to risk overheating the motor. Can someone help me with
this? Thanks in advance for any info. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 8
2006
|
| Yes, absolutely seriously. I have only used the remote-start control
to started a motor for the grand total of may be 4 times (in two
occasions) in my life (discounting the number of times when I started
small motor in rental boat by hand pulling to start). I still have a
learning curve to climb through. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 9
|
| Thanks for the tip of using the anti-sieze compound. The chance is
good that the ex-owner didn't apply any anti-sieze compound in the
lower unit based on the fact that the propeller was/is really stuck
from day-one when I bought the boat. I would like to ask you one question: Does replacing the impeller
involve removing the propeller as a part of the process? As I said
above, the propeller is really stuck. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 9
|
| Unfortunately for me, the telltail plug and the hose connecting to the
plug is not blocked. I ran a stiff wire into it, and I didn't feel
anything inside. Oh well, seem like the next step is to replace the
impeller. Thanks for the suggestion though. I always like to try the easiest
thing first. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 9
|
| There was plenty of water in the bucket to cover all the water inlets
in the lower unit. Somehow the ear-muff attachment didn't work for me last fall when I
winterized the motor. I had tried three different versions of ear-muff
attachment; neither worked. At that time, putting the lower unit
inside the water bucket was the only way that worked (in the sense that
I could see the telltail coming from the motor). Therefore, I choose
the "tried and true" method when I need to winterize the motor now --
Unfortunately for me, this method doesn't work this time. Actually, I
would much prefer to use the ear-muff attachment instead of using the
water bucket because using the ear-muff attachment is more convenient. I am guessing that may be the impeller was not working that well last
fall and was very marginal at best. After it has been sitting unused
for one year, it may have finally got stuck. Seem like I will need to
replace the impeller. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 9
|
| Whether it's part of the job or not, you may as well get the prop UNstuck.
It's a good idea to check for fishing line wound behind it, or so sayeth my
owner's manual. |
JoeSpareBedroom
Oct 10
|
| The muffs don't work on mine, either, unless I crank up a LOT of water. It's
like you have to create a solid wall of water within the cups. |
JoeSpareBedroom
Oct 10
|
| You are probably right. Last fall, somehow the ear-muff attachment
didn't work for the motor (probably the impeller was very marginal at
that time) and the engine was overheat; the only way to get the
telltail was putting the lower unit in a bucket of water, and this
allowed me to run the motor for 5 minutes and finish the winterizing. Seem like the impeller will have to be replaced. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 9
|
| I didn't remove the telltail hose. I ran a stiff wire up the hose and
I didn't feel any blockage. I doubt the telltail hose is being blocked
because I can see smoke coming from the telltail hole. I have a
feeling that if the telltail hose wass blocked, I should not see any
smoke coming out. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 9
|
| OK. If I need to remove the propeller in order to replace the
impeller, I will have to find a way to remove the propeller. I was
thinking of asking a marine mechanic to unstuck the propeller along
with checking a few things in the motor next spring (instead of doing
this myself). I guess I will have to move this up the schedule and
find a way to remove the propeller now, oh well... Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 9
|
| Jay, just out of curiosity, if you haven't used the boat in a year,
then why are you deciding to winterize it at this time? According to what yoyu say, it must have sat all through the colder
winter months of last year,a nd the first part of this year. why now? |
tschnautz
Oct 9
|
| >impeller, I will have to find a way to remove the propeller. STOP
You don't need to remove the prop for this.
You take out those bolts, drop the foot with prop still in place and
replace the impeller. It slides down the driive shaft and is nowhere
near the prop. Getting it off might be easier now than when you break a prop but be
careful you don't want to break something you don't need to right now.
You have a very good chance of trashing a seal when you are removing
the prop if you don't have the right tool. There is also a chance of
wiping the hub, even if you do have the pulller. |
gfretwell
Oct 9
|
| Yup. A local dealer at a boat show told me it should be done every
second year (depending on use). |
Don
Oct 10
|
| Every second year at MOST. Every year to be really safe. I killed a new impeller this year from April to Sept. I mean killed dead,
as it it stopped peeing at low RPM and the impeller was toast. A lot of
sandy / silty water will wear one out FAST. -W |
Clams
Oct 10
|
| In my area it's mostly salt water.... plus a good measure of sewage in
the city's harbour. On a sailboat the outboard will most likely rust
out before wearing out. |
Don
Oct 10
|
| Thanks for informing me that I really don't need to remove the
propeller. Then I can do that later or next spring instead of clamping
all these tasks in one weekend. I probably will still attempt to
remove the propeller by soaking it with WD40. But honestly I am not
expecting a miracle -- the propeller is quite stuck; there is quite a
good chance that I need to bring it to a dealer. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 10
|
| One question though: I think the idea of using anti-sieze compound is
to be able to remove the bolt easily. But a motor maintenance book
suggests me to use Loctite around the bolts that hold the lower unit to
the motor -- seem like trying to make the bolts really tight. Seem
like this is contrary to your suggestion. Does this have something to
do with the size of the motor? That book seems to suggest using
Loctite for motors that are above something like 40hp (or 75hp), and
don't make this suggestion for motors that are lower than that
horsepower. Thanks in advance for any info that you can offer. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 10
|
| I am wondering may be the smoke is coming from the fogging oil that I
sprayed inside motor cylinders last fall, and that was the last time I
started the motor. But you are probably right to say that the impeller is a goner. I have
already counted the impeller as a loss. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 10
|
| Jay, Based upon your questions, I can tell you are new to boating and new to
maintaining your engine. I would recommend you find a mechanic who
would make an appointment to get your engine serviced, and ask him if he
let you watch him remove the prop and install the impeller. While both of these projects are DIY projects, if you don't know what
you are doing, you can cause serious and expensive damages to the engine. While he has the engine in the shop, it will be worth him do a complete
inspection and servicing the engine to make sure there are not other
problems. As one of the rec.boats regulars found out, not servicing
your engine correctly can result in some very expensive problems. |
Reginald
Oct 10
|
| Seem like I am not the only one who has this problem. I didn't turn up the water volume when I was trying ear-muff attachment
because the motor manual only recommends moderate water volume to avoid
hurting the impeller or the water pump somehow. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 10
|
| >> size hole to lay an egg in and they mortar it shut. Run a stiff wire |
Gene
Oct 9
|
| Seriously??? Do you plan on looking at the manual every time you start the
motor? Checking for cooling water should be as instinctive as making sure
your dick's not about to be bitten by your pants zipper. |
JoeSpareBedroom
Oct 9
|
| Pull off the hose to the tell tale from inside the cowling. See if water
comes out. Lots of times a bug builds a nest in the hole, or some other
dirt plugs it up. Is a small orifice. |
Calif
Oct 9
|
| Be very carefull that you don't get all this advice mixed up. Sam |
Sam
Oct 9
|
| When the dust settles Jay will still have to replace the impeller. This
year he ran it for 30 seconds with no water stream but smoke/steam coming
from the tell tale hole. Same thing last fall for who knows how long. |
Oct 9
|
| >And also thanks for the link to the impeller kit; I quite likely need
>to order one. Make sure you get some anti-sieze compound (I llike a brand called
Neversieze) and work it into the threads of the bolts when you put
things back together. It is messy stuff but it will make it easierr to
get apart next time.
Now pray that the last guy did!
Basically 4 bolts right at the cavitation plate and one nut up in a
hole near the little fin in back will drop the foot. It helps to have
a helper but usually it will be stuck enough so it won't just fall.
Put some grease on the shaft splines when you go back together too.
The impeller is under that little can on top of the foot. (a couple
small bolts) |
gfretwell
Oct 9
|
| I'll ask a simple question. Is the bucket big and deep enough so that
the outboard's cooling water intake is below the surface? |
Don
Oct 8
|
| Yes. >Does the motor need to reach a
> certain temperature before the water stream coming out? No. The impeller is shot. Any easy replacement. Here is one source for the
replacement kit. http://www.outboardparts.com/mercury/mall/mercimpellerepairkits.htm |
Oct 8
|
| Either way, he needs to replace the impeller now. Jay, do not run the engine anymore until it is replaced as you can do some
serious damage to your engine. |
Oct 8
|
| edit ('an', not 'any') |
Oct 8
|
| Within one or two seconds. >>>Does the motor need to reach a certain temperature before
>>>the water stream coming out? No - the tell tale indicates that the impeller is working properly and
that there is water flow through the engine. It works independently
from the from the thermostat. If you are using mouse ears (flusher ears), make sure you are getting
adequate flow - some ears can be problematic when it comes to
providing water - it all depends on where the water intake is located
on the lower unit. If you are using a barrel or tub, make sure you have adequate water in
order to get the tell tale to work. Most likely the problem is lack of water, but you might have a bad
impeller. The only real way to find that out is to make absolutely
sure you have adequate water for the impeller to work on and try it.
Give it ten seconds, then shut it off if no tell tale water stream
appears. At that point, it's the impeller and you need to replace it. |
Tom
Oct 8
|
| >motor. Today, I put the lower unit into a bucket of water, and start
>the motor to winterize it. After trying to start it for a couple
>times, I finally manage to start it. Unfortunately, I cannot see the
>telltail water stream coming out from the motor cooling system. Make sure ity isn't just a plugged up pee hole. Some bugs like that
size hole to lay an egg in and they mortar it shut. Run a stiff wire
up there and try it. |
gfretwell
Oct 8
|
| Yes, the bucket is deep enough, and I have enough water to cover the
water inlets in the lower unit. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 9
|
| Thanks for the suggestion. The bucket is large and I have enough water
in it to cover the water inlets of the lower unit. Seem like I should
check if the hose connected to the telltail hole is blocked or not, and
I also need to look into replacing the impeller in the lower unit. At this point, I tend to believe that the impeller may have some
problem. The reason is that last fall when I tried to use an ear-muff
attachment to winterize the motor, I also could not see the telltail
from the motor. I ended up using the bucket to finish the task. Seem
like the impeller might be at its last leg in last fall, and now it is
done with. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 9
|
| Thanks for pointing out that I likely need to replace the impeller.
And also thanks for the link to the impeller kit; I quite likely need
to order one. Now, I need to write down on my boat-owner manual to expect to see the
telltail right after I have started the motor -- to prevent it from
confusing me again. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 9
|
| Thanks for the tip. This should be easy to try, and I will try this
when I get back home today. But I have a feeling that the telltale
hole is probably not plugged; otherwise, I should not see smoke coming
out from the telltail hole. Jay Chan |
jaykchan
Oct 9
|
