I pulled an Al

Some legitimately should be replaced under warranty for things like bad guide wrapping or eyelet inserts popping out. Others were broken due to my carelessness and a few I just don't know why the broke. With each one I included an honest description of how they got broken and what was wrong with them. I also included a check for $10 for return shipping with each package except for Lamiglass which specifies 14.50 on their website.

Here is what I have so far.

Silstar/Pinnacle. One Rod Sent. The fastest return was from them. I sent them a rod I gave my son for his birthday. I set a tool box down on it when fishing and broke it. Out of warranty, and definitely not the fault of the rod. They sent back a better quality rod than the broken one because the broken one was no longer in production. No problems, no questions.

St Croix one rod was definitely defective with an insert that had popped out, and I "found" the tip broken off the other. I think atleast one of them was less than a year old, but I could not find the receipts. The arrived the day after the Silstar rod with a note about things I should do to take better care of my rods.

Quantum. Two rods. Both probably broken from carelessness. No problem. One was no longer in production so they upgrade to slightly more expensive rod. I had no receipts included with these rods. These arrived back the same day as the St Croix rods.

Bass Pro Shops. Returned two identical Bionic Blade IM-8 rods. Both were defective. One had bad eyelet wrap glue and the eyes were coming off the other broke mid section when it was picked up with very little use or abuse (I don't care for these all that much because they are heavy.) I received one brand new replacement today, with reason why they only sent one.

Fenwick. Sent two almost new Eagle GT rods along with a receipt for 5 rods. (I like these for light spinner baits and crank baits.) One was definitely defective, and one was stepped on. I haven't yet heard from them. They received my package on t he 17th.

Lamiglas. Sent one 3 wt rod with receipt, and a check for 14.50. definitely under warranty damage was questionable. The tip of the rod broke off in transit to the ABA classic in November. The rod had seen very little use, and I don't think I did anything to damage it. When I took it out of the rod cover the tip was hanging from the line. I haven't heard from them yet. The did cash my check. It hit my account on the 24th. The package was delivered to them on the 17th.

Pflueger. Sent two rods with no receipt. Both damaged by abuse. No response.

I would say that Silstar and St Croix both went beyond what they were obligated to do. I am concerned about Lamiglass and Fenwick. I haven't a clue what to think about Bass Pro Shops given their normally more than generous return policy.

Bob La Londe www.YumaBassMan.com

Personally, in almost 60 years of fishing, I have been lucky to never having broken a rod through any accidents or abuse (probably because I am careful by nature), so I therefore resent having to pay for the carelessness of others. I believe that it is only right that businesses wake up and revert to the honest policy that "You break it, you buy it," and quit penalizing the rest of us.

I'm also inclined to agree with Rickard on this. If you know you broke it... then you ought to be the one responsible for replacing it. Same goes for the manufacturer... if it's defective, then it's only right that they eat the costs on it and hope that they learn something that can help them build a better product.

It's nice to know that there are businesses that do take care of their customers. I've been seeing less and less of that in the past few years.

I can't really remember how many rods that I've broken in my lifetime... I'd really hate to think about it.

Otherwise, they have a 5 year or lifetime guarantee depending on the particular model.

I have only returned one. It was a two piece and I sent only the top section that lost a guide insert. I didn't have my receipt but I honestly explained that it was less than one year old. They sent me a whole new rod with an explanation that two piece rods are paired at the factory for fit. There was a bill for (I think) $7.00 or so for return shipping that I promptly paid. That was about ten years ago and I haven't broken a rod since - freshwater or saltwater.

Dan

Dan

Bob's story is similar to one involving my son's Marlin .22 rifle. Just as Bob was honest about his rods, I was about the problem my son had with his Model 36.

It was jamming continuously on the feed ramp when chambering a round. A change of ammo brand made no difference, so I sent it directly to Marlin with a letter explaining the problem. I told them to call me with a cost estimate before beginning any work, as the rifle was not new when we purchased it. In fact, it was at LEAST five years out of warranty.

Two weeks later, we received the rifle back. In the package was a detailed list of parts and description of work performed. No charges whatsoever. They completely rebuilt the inner-workings of the receiver, replacing every moving part.

I called them and asked if there had been a mistake, as no one called to ask for a go-ahead to perform the work. The man replied, "No mistake. Tell your son to enjoy his rifle." He even declined my offer to at least pay shipping costs.

Defective? No. Manufacturer-caused lack of quality? No. Just a manufacturer that cares about their customers and wants to keep them for life.

They got a two-fer with this family.

------ The DNC - Building a bridge to the 20th Century.

I'm a messy, hard-on-my-equipment guy, and I fish a couple of times a week. I've not broken that many rods in ten years. You must have started with a lot more rods than I do. Wow.....

You are to be applauded for telling the companies the circumstances of the breakage. I also agree with Bob Rickard about the owner fixing or replacing his own breakage, though.

I took two rods in today to have eyes replaced. I stepped on one last week while fishing ( duhhh) and the other rod had a "temporary repair" done last summer by me. About $10.00 each eye to have them professionally replaced. Of course, while I was there ( Gander Mountain, in Houston TX) I had to buy yet another rod! regards,

I'll leave it at that...

Warren

That's it! I'm waiting! I'm excited!

------ The DNC - Building a bridge to the 20th Century.

I have had Craftsman tools break or wear out, and when I would return them I would find Craftsman no longer made that tool, so they would only replace with Sears brand, which came with no guarantee. I guess they didn't mean MY lifetime.

Mr. LaLonde , no offense meant. But for you to even think that a manufacturer might replace a rod broken by misuse, at some discount is somewhat dishonest in my mind. Your subject heading sez it all!

I have talked to a lot of manufacturers about Wal Mart's polices about returns, and their policy of paying for their merchandise

Its amazing to me how people can say some things or chose to put their own spin on things or even fail to understand things when they are behind a keyboard.

It just so happens that the only rods I am certain were damaged were from abuse or accidental damage were all two piece rods and it was the front section that was damaged. I see no reason they could not have simpley sent back a top section with the rod for less than it would cost to buy a complete rod with the expense of a reel seat and handle as well. I don't know anything about rod building or what is or is not repairable.

However if the rod has been damaged by abuse or misuse,our policy is that we will repair or replace at the owner's expense. I have actually had one guy tell me that he backed over the rod with his truck. And then had the unmitigated gall to ask what I would do about it.

In Bob LaLonde's case his poor choice of subject headings says it all "I pulled an Al" indeed !

mhood

Scott

I gotta get the Nitro back on the water SOON! Call me if you can ever get around Nashville.

The title was a joke. I never asked anybody for anything for free. I prepaid for return shipping in every circumstance. Anybody who doesn't want to fix or repair or replace my rod is welcome to put it back in the tube, cash my check, and slap a return label on the tube it came in. They could call me and make any offer they so choose. Just like you were free to tell your customer that you would not repair their rods.

But I doubt you will change your viewpoint or assumptions one iota. That is your right. Nothing I can do about it.

As a final thought, 80% of all rods failures are due to the person holding the rod having done something they weren't supposed to do.

mhood

Scott

Please post a summary of your findings when you get every rod handled. I'd be interested in your opinion.

Good luck! John

Warren

Warren

mhood

So far I still haven't heard from Fenwick or Lamiglas.

Both had clearly under warranty returns. I hope they are just slower, although delivery confirmation shows they both received my returned rods on the 17th of November. Gotta cut them some slack with it being a holiday right after though.

Lamiglass has cashed my check. Fenwick has not.

Bob La Londe www.YumaBassMan.com

Isn't it bad enough that this thread stirred up Rodney??!!??

Warren

Warren

Warren ;-)

To me, in my own opinion, it is basically a matter of personal integrity and your misunderstanding of the importance of it. Perhaps, in the end, we won't get questiooned on how many fishing rods we got replaced, but rather how many were replaced honestly.

"Bob La Londe" <usenet@diycomponents.com> wrote in message news:317brbF38ak3kU1@individual.net... Good Grief! I give up.

Like you, if a rod from me fails due to workmanship or materials and not abuse and/or neglect, the rod gets replaced. If the rod is broken through carelessness, if the person wants the rod replaced, they can send it back to me and I'll build another, but not for free.

This doesn't apply to "custom rod builders" of course. They don't really build rods, they just glue on some cork and wrap some thread on a blank that some rod company built.

Scott

When you're talking about high end fly rods, Winston, Sage, Thomas & Thomas, it's almost impossible for a custom builder to "build" a fly rod on those blanks for much less than the factory models. That's because the rod companies price their blanks that way. And when you buy from a custom builder you usually don't get, nor should you expect, the "no questions asked warranty."

Bob LaLonde is a man of total integrity and was absolutely right in the way he handled his returns. He knew that he had paid at the time of purchase for full entitlement to the manufacturer's return policies, whatever they may be, and he would have been a fool not to have taken full advantage of them.

Those manufacturers who build the "abuse insurance" into the original purchase price are the villains here and should be treated as such. They are taking the cheap and sleazy way out to protect their own butts and to try to look like heroes in the process. The buying public should never be tricked into paying for other's mistakes, and true manufacturing defects should never cost the buyer a penny to correct.

If you know where to find a comparable cannon for less I'd sure love to hear about it.

I also considered looking at Falcon's telescoping butt rods to fill a lot of my niches as its a pain to get a 7' rod into the floor locker on my boat. Unfortunately they don't label their rods for speed and power in a way I can understand.

Bob La Londe www.YumaBassMan.com

Chris

My Sage XP 3wt is a sweet stick, and my go-to rod for anything up to medium streams. When it was "this year's" model, it retailed for up above $600. I paid $250 for mine after it was carried as inventory for a few years, and I can tell you that the retailer made money on the deal.

I've seen the Sage discount program for guides, and a guide pays not much more than $275 for much of Sage's top of the line is today (I don't know about the TCR, though)--and Sage would still make money off the rod. Simms gear is much the same. A guide-friend of mine is trying to convince me to take the exam so I can take advantage of these discounts. I'd also have to recertify myself in CPR, and certify in First Aid and Community Water Safety to become a NY guide. Wholesale would be even less. I think I paid around $250 or less for my T&T 5wt. This isn't anywhere near the top of their line, but the T&T rep swore up and down that the only difference in the blank was that they sanded it on their more expensive model. I casted both, and couldn't tell the difference. The hardware is clearly cheaper, but it's not the chunk of wood under the reel that does the casting and mending. That rod is a 5wt cannon, and I can use it on the big sections of the Beaverkill and Delaware, even in a stiff wind. I know some folk that would use it for salmon (I wouldn't). It casts most big deer hair bugs with authority.

We can go back and forth about what makes a $600 rod worth $600. I think a good part of that is the warrantee (but my $100 St Croix Pro 8wt carries the same no-fault warrantee as my Sage--and you don't really need a precision piece of gear for chuck and duck trib fishing), but I know that the manufacturer's cost of the blank certainly isn't the main part of their cost.

Scott